3. That the safety of society is fully secured by the confinement of offenders.

4. That therefore, the State has no right to appropriate to itself the proceeds of the labor of criminals confined in the Penitentiary or otherwise, except only so far as may suffice to pay the current expenses of their support, and with the expenses incurred in their arrest and trial.

5. That any surplus earned by such criminals, after paying

the expenses above referred to, should be under their own con-
trol, subject to their draft on being legally discharged, or to
be devised by will in case of death.

6. That capital punishment should be abolished.
DEBATES AND PROCEEDINGS IN THE GERMAN LANGUAGE

Mr. REEMELIN. I move the adoption of the following resolutions.

Resolved, That the Reporter for this Convention be, and he is hereby, authorized and directed to enter into arrangments with one or more of the German newspapers of this State, for the daily and weekly publication in their columns of the proceedings and debates of this Convention, as published in the Ohio Statesman and Ohlo State Journal, provided, how ever, that the cost to the State of such publication shall not exceed that of the papers afore-mentioned.

Resolved, That the paper or papers entering into such arrangemont with the Reporter of this Convention, be, and they are hereby, authorized to publish the proceedings and debates of this Convention, as first published in the respective pa per or papers on their own private account in pamphlet or book form, or both, as they may deem proper.

to make no distinctions or restrictions in the resolutions; and because it will be a hardship on any paper which undertakes it. I care not who takes it, so the paper has a large circulation. I see no particular reasons for any restriction at all, as to number.

of the gentleman from Franklin, unless I could be in

Mr. LARWILL. I am in favor of the amendment

formed that the circulation of the Cincinnati German papers are much larger than that of the German paper in this City. The latter, I am informed, has a circulation of three thousand.

Mr. REEMELIN. The paper in Cincinnati, it is distinctly stated.has the largest circulation in the State. Mr. MITCHELL. I suggest the propriety of changing the resolution so as to authorize this publication in papers having the most general circulation. We don't want any particular, local circulation: we want a general circulation, for these debates.

Mr. REEMELIN. I accept the amendment of the gentleman from Knox.

The PRESIDENT. The gentleman cannot accept a modification of his resolution while a prior amendment is pending.

Mr. ROBERTSON. I hope the amendment of the Mr. MORRIS. I move to lay the resolutions on the gentleman from Franklin will be agreed to. The Gertable. Mr. REEMELIN. I know that question is not de-man paper published in this city is the paper almost batable, and must ask the gentleman to withdraw it

for a moment.

exclusively known and read amongst the German people throughout central Ohio. I know it is so in FairMr. MORRIS withdrew the motion accordingly. field, and if these debates are not in this paper they Mr. REEMELIN. I hope the resolution will not will be of but little benefit to the German people of be laid on the table, for it will cause great delay, and if should be selected, because it is published at the seat of that county. It is manifestly proper, that this paper a resolution of any kind is to pass, giving these debates and reports in the German language, it should be done government, for which reason it is sought for by the soon, for the printers who may undertake the work designated. It would be exceedingly improper to give Germans of this State; and I hope that paper will be will have to set up a great deal of matter heretofore the whole to the German papers in Cincinnati. I am published. While I am up I may say also, that I regret to bring up this subject, while some gentlemanated to publish these debates, but the other should be willing that one German paper there should be desigwho take the most interest in it, are not present. But I feel that I can't delay any longer. I will merely state that I have letters from publishers of German papers, who are willing to undertake this work on the same

terms which have been accepted by the papers in this city.

at the Capital.

Mr. LARSH. I move that the resolutions and amendments be referred to the select committee having charge of the subject of printing.

Mr. VANCE was understood to say, that that com. Mr. TAYLOR. I would enquire whether the remittee was discharged, and really had no existance. solution contemplates any expense beyond that pre-amendments were then referred to a select committee On motion by Mr. LEECH, the resolution and scribed by the law authorizing the Convention? That of three. The President subsequently appointed to provides only for an expense of twenty-five cents per constitute said committee, Messrs. Reemelin, Blickens.

thousand ems.

The reading being called for the resolution was again read through by the Secretary.

Mr. NASH. I move to strike out from the first part of the resolution, after the word "one," the words "or more," so as to read "one newspaper.'

Mr. REEMELIN. I had not expected an attack upon this proposition, from the opposite side of the House, for I considered it no more than justice, if we publish at all in the German languge, to publish in a whig as well as a Democratic newspaper. It will not cost more than 25 cents per thousand ems. I learn that, by both parties coalescing in the city, they can engage a translator upon such terms as will lessen the cost.

Mr. SMITH, of Warren. If the gentleman from Gallia will withdraw his motion, I will move to amend by inserting after the word "more," the words "not exceeding two."

Mr. NASH. Iexcept the modification.

Mr. SWAN. I propose to amend the amendment, by adding the words "one German paper in Columbus, and one in Cincinnati." I propose that amendment. Mr. GREEN of Ross. There is also one published in Chillicothe. [laughter.]

Mr. REEMELIN. With due deference to the gentleman from Franklin, I would not like the adoption of his amendment, for the single reason, that I desire

derfer and Swan.

PROPOSITION TO AMEND.

On motion by Mr. LARSH, the following resolution was read and referred to the Committee of the Whole on the state of the Commonwealth, to-wit:

Resolved, That it is expedient so to amend the constitution

as that the Secretary of State, or some other State officer, elected by the whole people, shall preside over the House of Representatives at the commencement of each session, until they shall have elected a Speaker.

MR. MASON'S PROPOSED AMENDMENT.

On motion by Mr. HAWKINS, the Convention now took up the consideration of Mr. MASON's proposition to amend the Constitution,offered on Friday last-creating the office of Lieut. Governor, and authorizing the Executive veto, and the same was referred to the committee of the Whole on the state of the Commonwealth.

On motion by Mr. SMITH of Warren, the Convention now resolved itself into a committee of the Whole on the state of the Commonwealth, (Mr. Cham bers in the Chair,) and took up the consideration of Mr. MASON's proposi son to amend the Constitution which was read through by the CHAIRMAN.

Mr. ARCHBOLD moved to strike out the word "majority" wherever it occurs in the 2nd section: butThe CHAIRMAN did not entertain the motion, say

ing that it would be as well to proceed in order, first to the consideration of the first resolution.

The first resolution was then read, and is as follows: Resolved, That it is expedient so to amend the constitution as to create the office of Lieutenant Governor, provide for his election, and prescribe his qualifications, powers, duties, and compensation.

Mr. HUMPHREVILLE. Mr. Chairman: I move to amend by striking out the word "compensation," in the 3d line of the first resolution, and changing the position of the word "and," so as to read "prescribe his qualifications, powers and duties."

Mr. ARCHBOLD. I think this provision would be very proper for the consideration of the General Assembly, but very improper for the consideration of this Convention. I hope the motion will prevail.

man.

And then the first resolution was passed over.
The CHAIRMAN now announced the consideration
of the second resolution, which he read, and it is as
follows:

vide that every bill or resolution which shall have passed
Resolved, That the constitution be so amended as to pro-
be presented to the Governor; if he approve, he shall sign it,
both houses of the Legislature, shall, before it becomes a law,
but if not he shall return it with his objections to that House
in which it shall have originated, who shall enter the objec
tions at large on their journal and proceed to reconsider it.
If after such reconsideration a majority of the whole number
present shall agree to pass the bill or resolution, it shall be
sent, together with the objections, to the other house, by
which it shall likewise be reconsidered, and if approved by
a majority of all the members present, it shall become a law,
notwithstanding the ebjections of the Governor. But in all
such cases, the votes of both Houses shall be determined by
yeas and nays, and the names of members voting for or
against the bill or resolution, shall be entered on the Journal
not be returned by the Governor within
of each house respectively. If any bill or resolution shall
days, (Sundays
excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the same
shall be a law in like manner as if he had signed it, unless
the Legislature shall, by their adjournment, prevent its re-
turn, in which case it shail not be a law.

Mr. HAWKINS proposed to amend by striking out all after the word "resolved."

Mr. MASON. Mr. Chairman: I will limit myself to a remark or two,on the precise motion of the gentle I suppose that it is thought eminently proper, sir, to provide in the constitution for the fact of compensation to a State officer, by making at least a declaration that compensation shall be given to him according to law-such compensation as may be provided by law. I should be sorry, sir, to create a new office, of the importance of that which is proposed to be created by the resolution, and not declare in the Mr. MASON. I will not presume to inflict upon constitution that he shall have a compensation, to be this committee a regularly constructed speech, nor to provided by the legislature. Allow me to say, sir, that go into the argument at large, on the various considit is no part of my object to declare that the Constitu-erations that are brought into view by the proposition tion shall ascertain and fix this compensation, but that that is now moved to be stricken out. The State of the constitution shall provide for a compensation. I my health would not permit of it, if I were otherwise do not know that I would be willing to fix the com- disposed; and I candidly avow I am not willing to enpensation in the constitution at all. I do not know but ter into an elaborate debate of this ques ion. I will I would be willing to fix a minimum. I do not know refer to some of the considerations which have induced but I would be willing to say that this officer shall re- my desire for the introduction of such a proposition as ceive a per diem compensation during ths session of the this into our constitution. I have long desired that General Assembly,-supposing him to have conferred the Governor of the State of Ohio should stand in upon him the power of presiding over the deliberations some official relation to the Legislation of the State. of the Senate. I do not know but I would be willing I have long considered it a defect that the General Asto declare, in the constitution, that he should receive sembly has not found, and in point of practice I have a per diem for that service, or any other he might ren- understood, did not so far feel itself under the obligader, while engaged in performing the service of the tion of courtesy, as to send to the Governor their bills Governor, in case of his disability or death. That he and resolutions that he might be required to transmit should receive such compensation as may be provided to the executive of other States, or to the executive of by law, is the spirit of the language of the resolution; the United States. He is to find that out in the and I cannot see any objection to the term as it stands. best way and manner that he may. I know that there Indeed, I apprehend that our work would be very in- exists in the public mind strong prejudices for and complete if we should say nothing in the constitution against the power called the veto power. It might upon the subject of compensation. I do hope, sir, that have been supposed, probably, by some, that I would this resolution will find favor with the Convention, so not have been the first person to have offered such a far as to permit the office to be created; and I have the proposition as this. Sir, I have ever been in favor of pleasure to say, that there is yet no indication that such just such a provision in the constitution as the one I will not be the decision of the body. This motion pre-have now submitted. I have ever been opposed to the sents no such question. This is all I feel called upon veto power, believing that it conferred on one man a to say upon that particular proposition. I hope power greater than ought to be conceded to any one the gentleman will be induced to re-consider man in a republican form of government. Vete, "I the suggestion about striking out the word, es- forbid," is a proposition that I never could be persuapecially after the explanation has been made that ded to introduce into a deliberative body. But, the nothing more is contemplated than that the Conven- proposition that is now submitted, does no more than tion should so far consider of the matter of compensa- this; it places in their hands or in the power of the tion as to determine whether it should be provided by law, or whether it should constitute a more specific provision in the Constitution. Whether the one, or the other, or both, shall be done, I shall rest satisfied not doubting that one or the other, at least, ought to be done.

Mr. ARCHBOLD. I have no general hostility to the gentleman's proposition at all. I would suggest that the object of both the gentleman from Medina and myself,might be attained by transposing two words so as to read, "that it is expedient so to amend the Constitution as to create the office of Lieutenant Governor, as to provide for his election and compensation, and to prescribe his qualifications, powers and duties." Mr. MASON. I accept the modification.

executive to ask--and not only to ask, but under a constitutional requisition to require, the General Assembly to reconsider its action-its final vote, the vote just had, on the bill or resolution that has passed, with the advantage of an official communication of the reatsou operating on the mind of the executive that a propossion in the shape it was passed should not become a ilaw. It is a reconsideration; it is not a veto. And, sir, I am not so timid as that I am afraid of the word veto. I never was afraid to perform any duty, as far as I remember, but I do not choose to apply the term "veto" to this proposition for two reasons. First, that there is much of prejudice connected with it, in the public ind. Secondly, because it is not a veto, and it has scarcely so much as the resemblance or sim

ilitude even of a veto. The object is to secure to the country more careful and well considered legislation. That is the object of the power that is here proposed to be conceded to the Governor. All gentlemen who have been members of deliberative bodies-all who have been in the habit of observing the action of legislative bodies, have become satisfied that much of our legislation is done in haste, some of it in passion, some of it under excitement, and some of it is done with great, I might add, reprehensible care lessness.

not become a law, and when those reasons shall be published to the people, there will then be made up an issue between the Executive and the Legislature. I have had the honor of being a member of the General Assembly, and of the different branches of it more I claim to know somewhat of the action than once. of that body. It is the fountain of power in the State of Ohio. It is the great absorbing and over-shadowing power of the State. They can make and unmake not only law, but men and offices. It is the fountain of When a bill shall have passed both houses of the patronage. All the while, your Governer is boarding Legislature, and shall have been presented to the Gov- and holding his "levees" in a wretchedly furnished bed ernor for his examination, he examines it in the quiet room in some public hotel, [laughter] at the seat of and stillness of his office, without having participa- government; and who is never thought of, unless ted in the heats, or in the passions, or in the prejudi- there is a convict to be pardoned, or there is a notary He public to be appointed in one of your villages. It is ces of the bodies that have acted on the subject. brings to the consideration of a measure all of that true he has got the high sounding titles of "commander calmness, deliberation and undisturbed action of his in chief of the army and admiral" of your navy, in mind, that is eminently calculated to produce a just the state of Ohio. For forty years have those honors and a certain judgment in regard to the merits of the clustered around his brow and yet his office is laughed If he at, ridiculed, and has become the laughing stock of the bill, and every proposition submitted to him. cannot sign it, he is required to return it to the body people. But in these things I may be mistaken and I honestly entertain in which it originated, showing cause by written rea- gentlemen may differ with me. sons, that are required to be recorded on the journal this opinion and I deeply felt a conviction that we of that body, to be examined by that body. And, if ought to connect the Chief Magistrate of the State after a calm examination in the additional light that with the Legislative power so as to give him the right may be reflected by the argument of the Executive, to call on the Legislature to reconsider what they have that body shall pass the measure, by the same majori- done hastily, in passion, in prejudice, and what they ty that passed it originally, it shall then be transmit may have done in ignorance. ted to the other brauch, with the Governor's reasons. It shall then be entered on the journal of that house, and the yeas and nays shall be there taken on the adoption or rejection of the proposition under consider ation. In that way the people will secure all the deliberation that is desirable in the passage of a law that is to become their rule of action. Thus, the effect of the existence of this provision in your constitution will be to superinduce greater attention, painstaking, and deliberation in the respective bodies of the Legislature. The power of sending back for further consideration a proposition sent to the Governor may not be asserted once in a session, perhaps not once in five or ten years. The fact that there is another power to judge, to examine and to present to the country,an issue with that Legislature, is a fact the effect of which cannot be lost on that deliberative body. I should value this power greatly, if it were for nothing more than the great advantage I would expect the country to derive from the greater caution in the action of their Representatives in the Legislature.

There is another reason-there is a great deal of local legislation-and if there were no local legislation, still the legislative power is placed in the hands of gentlemen who come from small and comparatively narrow and limited districts of the country. There is a want therefore of "homogeneousness" in your legislation.You should have men elected by the whole people of the state to preside over the deliberations of your Legislature, and another man also elected by the people at large who by this proposition, will have the right to call on the Legislature to reconsider what they have done. I expect from this proposition the effect of introducing more congruity into your legislation more consistency of provision; and more of that which is homogenuous would belong to the people of the entire State than were legislation concocted, as it may be, by that wretched system of log rolling, "you help me and I will help you." In that way many laws are passed that are iniquitous, and that do not apply to, or regard the interests of the whole State.

I want a man there who will have some check and And again, sir, the effect of conferring this power some control, as her indicated, for the purpose of on the Executive, in the State of Ohio, is one that correcting some of those evils. I may attach too much commends itself to my sincere judgment. The office importance to this view of the subject The desirableof Governor, in the State of Ohio, has become one al-ness of the object will not be questioned by any genmost degraded in the constitution itself. It has been tleman in the committee. The means by which it is created, and some nominal power conferred on it; but proposed to bring it about, may be esteemed by many no such power as has contributed to give dignity and a one, as not the wisest, nor perhaps the best calcuconsideration to the Executive office; and I make these lated to produce that end. I entertain the opinion that remarks with no sort of pleasure-these remarks are it will have the effect I have ascribed to it. To some self-evident to the minds of the intelligent gentlemen extent it will make our laws more as they should be, composing this committee. You have all seen, with and more as I consider laws ought to be, partaking of myself, that the office of Governor of Ohio is of so the character of the general institutions, and general little public dignity and consideration, that his very sentiments of the entire people, where views too narrow recommendations, under the constitution, to the Gen- have been engrafted into a bill. Your executive, eleceral Assembly, are about so many reasons for disre- ted by yourselves and your constituen's, will be emgarding whatever he says to that body. The effect of powered to do what?-to veto? No. To say it shall this proposition will be to ensure the further examina- not become a law? No, sir; but to call on that body tion and consideration on the part of the Legislature, and asz them to reconsider what the have done. I want with the aid of the reasons why the measure ought to be a man in office to call upon that proud body-that rejected or modified. I would therefore,give that officer domineering, overshadowing power to review their the power of exerting some check and control over the work-tell them what is to be done and to give them forwardness and waywardness of Representative and his reasons for so doing, and then let them rep ss the Senatorial bodies. And when the reasons shall be bill on their own responsibility with these reasons on known, which he may assign, that a given bill should the record against them. If they choose let them do it.

Sir, I am sorry to have taken up so much of your time, and that I have occupied it so little to my own satisfaction--and yours.

They know what those objections are, and the coun-utive. If the wisdom of this body should suggest that try will know how to go into the ensuing election to we should adopt it, I shall not object, for, indeed there decide upon the merits of this controversy between the is no very considerable objection to it. They have adopExecutive and the Legislature. I do not wish to speak ted the principle in the New York Constitution, of remore at length on this question, for reasons that I have al quiring a majority of two thirds of the members presready expressed. I will, however, take notice of the mo- eut on the passage of a bill or proposition returned by tion that has been already made. I had supposed when I the Governor for the consideration of the Legislature. submitted the proposition, that some members of the In the Arkansas Constitution and others I understand, committee might be inclined to carry it further than I it requires a two-third majority of all the members elechave done. I had supposed there would be gentlemen ted. I do not deem it worth the trouble of making the here who would favor the carrying of the power to the amendment in regard to the majority of those "present" extent of requiring a two-third vote in relation to a bill and a majority of those "elected." All the members or proposition sent back by the Executive. I will not might not be present-some might be absent from difenter into the argument of that important question. Iferent causes-there might be a vacancy-some may have seen the operation of it, and there are others in be sick or have returned home at the moment the the committee who have seen it, and some who may vote was taken. In that case it would require a little have been pleased with it. But allow me to say in all more than a majority of all voting-yet, I would supsincerity and candor, I never have been able to bring port the proposition, nevertheless I declare, I prefer that my judgement and understanding to the conclusion the bill should be passed by the same power and the that it was desirable to give one man the power of two- some sort of a majority that passed the bill originally, thirds of the House of Representatives and of the Sen- for I believe that we shall have done enough for the ate. I have ever regarded it as inconsistent with the ge- dignity of the office of Governor, and for the improvenius of our institutions. I mean that in no other de- ment of Legislation, if we adopt the provision as it is partment nor in any other institution of this State, is stated in this resolution. power accumulated, in the hands of any one man-and I would not give the Governor of your State, a gentleman possessing no higher talents, experience or attainments than many members to be found in the different Mr. ARCHBOLD cordially agreed with the distinbranches of the legislaure, a power equal to two-thirds guished gentleman from Clark [Mr. MASON] in the senof the Legislature. I would not give him a power so timents contained in the first part of his remarks. But large, that it could not be overcome without resorting he went farther. He wished to place some real power to a yote of two-thirds of all the members present in in the Governor's hands. He proposed in his former the two Houses of the Legislature. I would not put amendment to strike out the word "majority," where it in the power of the executive to defeat the will of a it occurred in the sixth line of the second section and constituent body. I may differ, sir, with other honor-insert the word "two-thirds," then there would be the able members of this committee in regard to this ques- same amendment in the seventh line before the word tion, but I hold that the legislative power is appropriately, and most justly, and effectively deposited with the representatives of the people in the two branches of the Legislature. I would not defeat that will by any action of the executive. But I would do this;if it should be defeated let it be done through the moral power exerted on the minds of the legislators themselves, when they come to examine the reasons that have been submitted as so many objections to their action, and if on the consideration of those reasons, they come to the conclusion that it should not become a rule of action, then it is that members would become the instruments of defeating their own measures, otherwise, it is defeated by one man,and that man perhaps not of higher attainments than the very men to be found in the two branches of the body. I do not know what effect the argument may produce on the minds of others-it is not new, I suppose, to any gentleman, it is not new to me. If however,it were proposed to carry the power to an extent greater than that, that moment you have converted me into an opponent of the propositon. Even if that were done, I do not mean to say that I would regret having introduced this proposition. It is a proper one in my judgment.

members. He concurred in everything that the gentleman had said in relation to the degradation of the office of Governor, and thought it was anything but a sinecureship. He did not mean that the officers who had occupied that office were degraded, some of them were of his most valued friends. It was not to the officers he objected, but to the want of dignity and respectability connected with the office. The gentleman had alluded to the legislative course of some parties; he would, however, appeal to all who had been in the Legislature and ask them if they could not look back upon that part of their course in which they were engaged in defeating measures, and preventing unwise legislation with the utmost complacency.

Had they not been called on several times today, to take upon themselves the business of the General Assembly? It was a general sentiment that the Legislature should not be in session more than once in two years, unless called together by an extraordinary occasion. In his county there was not a man, he supposed, in favor of annual sessions of the Legislature. The gentleman had begun to fix up a medicine for the evil of excessive legislation, but his dose is too weak. When scribblers had written too Before I came here I contemplated, if no one else did, much, they were said to have the disease called the to submit this proposition to the consideration of the cacathes scribbendi; it seemed to him that when the body. Therefore, I shall not regret having introduced Legislature got here they were taken with the disease it. I know that it would come before this body in some of cacathes legislendi. The doctrine of the gentleman form when they came to take action on the Legisla- from Clark, (Mr. MASON,) he considered to be good as tive department. I shall deeply regret if it should far as it went, but notwithstanding it was offered with be the pleasure and purpose of this body to carry the the best of intentions, it would prove a dead letter. power beyond the extent indicated in the proposition. The power of veto was not an a: bitrary power, it was There is another point to which I wish to call atten- only an intimation of dissent to what the executive tion, and it is, that I will not allow myself to be driven considered unwise and amounted to a solemn appeal to from the support of the proposition, if it should be the people. He hoped the gentleman had not made up carried to the extent of requiring a majority of all the his mind to reject the mode of amendment proposed. persons elected to both houses of the Legislature in or- There were reasons which were weighty for passing that der to repass a bill that has been returned by the Exec-resolution.

Mr. NASH. I would suggest to the gentleman from Mr. LARWILL moved that the Convention do now Auglaize the propriety of withdrawing his objection. adjourn, which was agreed to. We had his objection to a similar matter on yesterday,