1st. Resolved, That so much of the constitution as relates to the legislative de partment, be referred to a committee to take into consideration the expediency of making any, and if any, what alterations therein, and to report such amendments as they may deem expedient.

2d. Resolved, That so much of the constitution as relates to the executive de partment, be referred to a committee to take into consideration the expediency of making any, and if any, what alterations and amendments therein, and to report such amendments as they may deem expedient.

31. Resolved, That so much of the constitution as relates to the judicial department, be referred to a committee to take into consideration the expediency of making any, and if any, what alterations or amendments therein, and to report such amendments as they may deem expedient.

4th. Resolved, That so much of the constitution as relates to the council of revision, be referred to a committee to take into consideration the expediency of making any, and if any, what alterations or amendments therein, and to report such amendments as they may deem expedient.

5th. Resolved, That so much of the constitution as relates to the power of ap pointment to office, and the tenure thereof, be referred to a committee to take into consideration the expediency of making any, and if any, what alterations or amendments therein, and to report such amendments as they may deem expedient.

6th. Resolved, That so much of the constitution as relates to the right of suffrage and qualifications of persons to be elected, be referred to a committee to take into consideration the expediency of making any, and if any, what alterations or amendments therein, and to report such amendments as they may deem expedient.

7th. Resolved, That so much of the constitution as relates to the rights and privileges of the citizens and members of this state, together with the act entitled an act concerning the rights of the citizens of this state, be referred to a committee to take into consideration the expediency of making any, and if any, what alterations and amendments therein, and to report such amendments as they may deem expedient. 8th. Resolved, That all the parts of the constitution not embraced in the preceding resolutions, be referred to a committee to take into consideration the expediency of making any, and if any, what alterations or further provisions therein, and to report such amendments as they may deem expedient.

9th. Resolved, That a committee be appointed to enquire into the expediency of establishing the commencement of the legislative year; also, whether any, and if any, what alterations ought to be made in the term for which any elective officer may be elected.

10th. Resolved, That it be referred to a committee to take into consideration the expediency of making any, and if any, what provisions for future alterations or amendments to the constitution of this state, and to report such amendments as they may deem expedient.

The resolutions having been read, Mr. Root moved that the question be taken on the whole at once.

CHIEF JUSTICE SPENCER moved that they be read, and the question taken upon them separately; which course was adopted, and the resolutions all passed in the affirmative.

GEN. ROOT moved that the several committees consist of seven members. Carried.

GEN. ROOT submitted the following resolution.

Resolved, That the committee on the legislative department be instructed to inquire into the expediency of providing in the constitution, that no law increasing the pay of members of the legislature, shall take effect till after the expiration of the legislative year in which it shall have been passed.

Some little discussion arose upon the manner in which this resolution should be disposed of, and it was finally laid on the table till to-morrow.

The Convention then adjourned until 1 o'clock P. M. of to-morrow, in order to give the President time to make a suitable selection of membors of the several committees.

SATURDAY, SEPTEMBER 1, 1821.

Prayer by the Rev. Mr. DAV13. The Convention was then called to order, at 1 o'clock, and the minutes of yesterday were read and approved.

MR. P. R. LIVINGSTON. Before you proceed, Mr. President, to exccute the important trust recently imposed on you; that of selecting committees to embrace the different subjects selected for them respectively, I shall offer a resolution, the object of which will be, to augment and increase those committees. When I approach this Convention, I recognize character, wealth, talent, and patriotism. I know, sir, that I am addressing the majesty of democracy in its delegated character; and on all occasions, I shall attach to it that respect, which so dignified an assemblage of citizens will always command. I know that we are about to take into consideration a subject, which has for its aim the public good; and under the auspices of that Being, who directs and presides over the destinies of man, I trust we shall be guided to a course of action, which will have for its object, the interest, honor, happiness, and prosperity of this commonwealth. In the appointment of the committee recommended by my honorable friend from Queens, there was not much importance attached to the resolution; but filled up as these committees have been in point of numbers, there is much importance growing out of it. The Convention have now settled the mode and manner in which we are to proceed in determining the vital principles of the constitution, which are to be submitted to the consideration of this body. Is it not wise to avail ourselves of the talent and ability of this Convention, by increasing the number of these committees? By the introduction of a resolution yesterday, which confines the number of each committee to seven, you now have but seventy members engaged; fifty-six are necessarily to be unemployed until the report of some of these committees shall be presented to this Convention. It is in the chamber, where information is to be had; it is not on the floor of the Convention where talents may be opposed, and eloquence give a wrong direction. There are many men of fine minds, who do not possess floor talents; and by the course which has been adopted we shall be deprived of the benefits of their counsel, of their wisdom and prudence. Is it not better that every member be attached to some one of these committees, where others may avail themselves of his information, or where he may obtain such information as he may need?

It will not, nor can it be said, that those committees will be too numerous. I believe that in a sister state they have adopted the wisest course in submitting the constitution to a committee of the whole. You cannot compare the proceedings of this body with ordinary legislative proceedings-the latter, in ninety-nine cases out of a hundred, are local in their nature, while the former have no other boundary than the marginal limits, which terminate the jurisdiction of its power.

If this resolution shall prevail, (and there can be no other objection to it than the delay of a single day) we shall then all be employed in the business before us. No man has more regard for the most rigid economy than myself; and I would not procrastinate the proceedings of this body, or expend a single cent of the public money, beyond what is necessary. I believe, sir, the plan proposed by the resolution will not be the means of retarding our progress; but by uniting the wisdom and talents of all the members, the business of the Convention will be expedited. If the number of five be added to each of the committees, it will leave a fraction of six members, who may be disposed of as the importance of particular committees may make it necessary. I therefore, with these views, tenacious of them because impressed upon me by a regard to the public interest, to promote which we are here asse:nbled, offer the following resolution :

Resolved, That the respective committees appointed to report on the several parts of the constitution referred to them, be augmented, and that the number of five be added to each committee.

This resolution was subsequently modified, so that six should be added to the first five committees, and five to the remaining ones, which would embrace all the members.

CHIEF JUSTICE SPENCER disapproved of the course proposed by the gentleman from Dutchess. It would cause considerable delay in the proceedings, since another day or two would be consumed in filling up the committees, and by being rendered too numerous, their proceedings would be retarded. He believed it to be unusual in legislative proceedings, to appoint an even number of members on committees, as they might be divided in opinion, and a report thereby be delayed or prevented. The committees appeared to him sufficiently numerous for all the purposes intended. If he understood the duty assigned them, it was merely to present to the Convention, in a condensed form, the subjects for deliberation, which would form topics of discussion in committee of the whole. The gentleman from Dutchess erred in supposing that these several committees would assemble together, and discuss the subjects referred to them -this would be the business of the whole Convention after the reports of the several committees were made. On the whole, he thought an increase in the number of the members composing the committees unnecessary, and therefore hoped the resolution would not be adopted.

MR. LIVINGSTON replied, that he must have been strangely misunderstood, or be very limited in his views, if he had said any thing from which it could be inferred that he supposed all the committees were to assemble together; the man who could have supposed such an absurdity, was unfit to be in this Convention. But he did suppose, and he hoped to convince the honourable gentleman who last spoke, that there would be very great advantages growing out of an increase of these committees. They are not appointed to examine subjects of an ordinary concern; but the great charter of our rights will be laid before them. Every member comes with views, correct or incorrect, of that charter; and will my honourable friend pretend to say, that there is not more wisdom in twelve than in seven? And will not these twelve by a discussion of the topics submitted to them, gain much important information, and be better qualified to act on the subject hereafter? He asked how he was to obtain his information? Suppose that honourable gentleman was chairman of a committee on the subject of the judiciary, and that he should come into committee of the whole, fortified with strong reasons, and information derived from private deliberation, he would in such case enjoy a decided advantage over others; and it would be extremely difficult for those, who did not possess floor talents, to raise this or that objection, although they might be men of sound understandings.

He would ask that honourable gentleman, how fifty or more men were to cmploy their time, while the committees were preparing their reports? Would it not be better that they should be associated with the several committees in their chambers, where they might be acquiring information, which would enable them to act more advisedly on the subjects, which will hereafter come before them? We cannot, it is true, be present with all the committees-would to God we could. Another objection raised is, that the committees will be an even number-that is an imaginary difficulty; it is one that will not be realized. Would any member of such a committee take it upon himself to say, that no report should be made unless such as to suit his own views? It would be made by the chairman, although others might not assent to it. He said we did not come here to exercise feelings of passion, or those feelings which would grow out of intemperate discussion.

He presumed it was the wish of every delegate to bring the subject fairly before the convention; to discuss it with moderation, and give it all that dispassionate consideration, that its importance might require, before it is submitted for the decision of that power, which created us, and to which we are answerable. Another difficulty which has been suggested is, that the President would belong to one of these committees, which he thought would be improper. He concluded with hoping, that his resolution would be well considered, before the Convention should decide on it, as he felt much solicitude that it might be adopted.

COL. YOUNG remarked, that the committees would deliberate out of the ordinary hours of sitting, and would not break in upon the regular proceedings of the Convention. IIe was rather disinclined to add to the number of these com

mittees, because he thought it would produce unnecessary delay; it would take a committee of thirteen longer to agrec on a report, than it would a committee of seven. The object for which these committees were appointed, was to bring before the Convention the principles which were to be discussed in committee of the whole; and when these principles shall have been submitted to the collective wisdom of all the members, they will then be moulded into such shape, as a majority can agree to. He did not think any proposition would be adopted in the exact words of these committees. The propositions reported will undergo a thorough scrutiny from each member, and receive such amendments as may be deemed adviseable. He concurred in the remarks which were made by the gentleman from Delaware, a fety days since, that if the committees were too numerous, the members would in some measure feel themselves committed by their private deliberations and reports, and thus opposition would afterwards he unavailing. If the committees were to be augmented, another day would be taken up in making such additions. The committees as now constituted, would probably be able to report in the course of a few days-the one on the right of suffrage might be ready by Monday-when we can go into committee of the whole, and enter upon a discussion of the report. The other reports may be prepared in a few days, and in acting on them we shall all be occupied. The question was then taken on the resolution, and lost.

The President thereupon named the following gentlemen to compose the several committees, viz.

On the legislative department-Messrs. King, Kent, Paulding, Sage, Rose, Ten Eyck and Lawrence.

On the executive department-Messrs. Sheldon, Wendover, Huntington, Yates, Stagg, Pitcher and Пogeboom.

On the judicial department-Messrs. Munro, N. Williams, J. Sutherland, Silvester, Wheaton, Duer and Wheeler.

On the council of revision-Messrs. Tallmadge, Platt, Ward, Nelson, Brooks, Russell and Van Horne.

On the appointing power-Messrs. Van Buren, Birdseye, Collins, Buel, Child, Edwards and Rhinelander.

On the right of suffrage-Messrs. Sanford, S. Van Rensselaer, Peter R. Livingston, Fairlie, Young, Cramer and Ross.

On the bill of rights--Messrs. Sharpe, Spencer, Hunter, I. Smith, Lefferts, M'Call and Richards.

On the parts of the constitution not embraced in the preceding resolutionsMessrs. Radcliff, Bacon, R. Clarke, Pike, Schenck, and Briggs.

On the commencement of the legislative year—Messrs. Root, Lansing, J. R、 Van Rensselaer, Price, Beckwith, Rosebrugh and Burroughs.

On provision for future amendments-Messrs. Swift, Van Vechten, Darlow Steele, Tuttle, E. Williams and Verbryck.

The members of each committee were again named singly by the President, and approved by the Convention.

MR. FAIRLIE remarked, that the phrase elective franchise, had been made use of in some of the previous proceedings. He believed the term improper, and hoped the phrase right of suffrage would hereafter be used in its stead.

GEN. RooT then called for the consideration of the resolution (relative to the pay of members of the legislature) which he yesterday offered, and which was ordered to lie on the table.

MR. DUER hoped the gentleman from Delaware would consent to withdraw his resolution. The committees to whom had been referred the several parts of the constitution were competent to the task assigned them, and it appeared to him obviously improper, in this stage of the business, to attempt to instruct them in their duty. He presumed the gentleman from Delaware had fall confidence in the committee, to whom the subject of his resolution would be referred; and it would be better to wait till they had reported, and if the amendment which seemed to lie so near the gentleman's heart was overlooked, it might then be called up by resolution. He deprecated the precedent, which the adoption of this resolution would establish. If one member were permitted to call the attention of the Convention to a particular point, and to some favour

ite plan of his own, other members might follow the example, and the proceedings of the Convention would thus be embarrassed and delayed by a multitude of individual propositions, some of which might not be so proper, as the one offered by the honourable gentleman from Delaware. Such a course would frustrate the objects for which committees had been appointed. If any gentleman believed that he could aid the several committees by his suggestions and instructions, he was at liberty to impart his advice. He repeated, that if gentlemen were dissatisfied with the reports of the several committees, there would then be an opportunity for offering resolutions by way of amendment. He therefore hoped the gentleman from Delaware would see the force of the reasons, which had been suggested, and consent to withdraw the resolution.

GEN. ROOT. The honourable gentleman from Orange, wishes me to withdraw my proposition, which may be a reasonable request; still I must be pardoned for insisting on having a distinct vote taken on the resolution, instead of being "struck" so forcibly with the impropriety of the course which I have undertaken to pursue. Yesterday it was premature to instruct the committee, because it was not appointed ;—to day it is premature, says another gentleman, because it looks like censuring that committee. When shall we instruct them? When they shall have made their report? Yes, this will be time enough, when they have performed the duties assigned them, and made their report! then will be the time, if they have neglected this provision, to give them their instructions ! Sir, while that honourable gentleman supposes that it shows a want of decorum, in calling the attention of a committee to a particular subject, he does not recur to the newspapers, which he so frequently reads, to see that it is the custom in the house of representatives of the United States, as well as in the legislature of this state. It would seem, from the gentleman's argument, that individuals are to go before these committees, and instruct them what to do: for my part, I wish that the Convention might have the privilege of telling them, rather than an individual and humble member. I wish to speak to them not only in language which they can understand, but such as they will be willing to obey. But the gentleman asks, with a great stress of interrogation, what would prevent other gentlemen from offering propositions of this kind? I answer him, nothing. I hope and trust in God, that nothing is able to prevent any gentleman, save the power of Heaven, from submitting propositions to the consideration of this Convention; and can any person elected to this Convention prevent another from offering a proposition? If so, perhaps I may be so "struck" with the force of the gentleman's argument, as to be willing to withdraw my proposition. It has been said that projects may be offered disgraceful to this honourable body? Where is there a gentleman who would presume to offer any thing to the consideration of this Convention which would be disreputable? Is there an individual in this august body that would descend from the dignity of his station, and make such an offer? Sir, it is suitable, and it is important, that these committees, intrusted with the several branches of the constitution, should make an entire report, when they do report, and before it shall be taken up in committee of the whole. We are informed, that it would be better to wait till these committees shall have reported, and then instruct them; and let them bring in a supplementary report. This will, in my opinion, produce greater confusion than the course which the learned and honorable gentleman so much deprecates.. I believe no one will deny that this proposition is important; I consider it important, from the experience of years, and from evidence which has frequently come under my view. Just at the close of the session, when the supply bill is under consideration; and in one instance, when on a bill in relation to the commissary general, members have been found scrambling for a little additional pay; thrusting their hands into the treasury for a little money, that the people never consented they should take. Sir, I have witnessed many a disgusting scene of that kind ; and now as the people are assembled in convention, I am anxious to pursue such a course, as will prevent their being acted over hereafter. Let them provide for the pay of their successors, and my word for it, it will not be enormously high; because if some of the members expected to be re-elected, they would hardly dare to vote for the highest pay, for fear the people would animadvert at the polls of the election. This would be a sufficient