Second, the Church of the Brethren has endeavored to carry its full share of the education load of the country through our program of higher education. We have through this medium contributed measurably to the scientific, educational, political, and religious leadership of the country. Our emphasis has been on liberal education, intelligent leadership, moral and spiritual integrity, and creative citizenship. Higher education is bound to discover and defend the truth and seek to apply it to the human welfare. We must assert liberty of scholarship and of thought in the interest of sound education.

The proposed policy is, in our judgment, a reversal of American tradition in education. The Army and Navy are not educational institutions. Their objectives are military. Their program of training is highly specialized, authoritative, and rigidly prescribed. It seeks to establish conformity and obedience rather than independent leadership. The system presents a pattern of military indoctrination which has prevailed for many years in Germany and Japan and has twice in our generation brought its scourge upon the world.

We believe the system represents a dangerous trend in education and we object to it out of our interest in the American ideal of education.

Third, the Church of the Brethren objects to universal compulsory military training on international grounds. We believe that fear, suspicion and military rivalry among the nations of the world are one of the large contributors to war. Peacetime conscription is essentially nationalistic. It stands in contradiction to our international policy as expressed in the Atlantic Charter, the Dumbarton Oaks Declaration and in the avowed objectives of the San Francisco Conference. "Conscription has never stopped war nor made war less frequent.' It places a strain on international relationships and is a threat to peace and order among nations.

Because our religion demands our supreme loyalty to God rather than to the state, we are unalterably opposed to the principle of conscription. Because democracy cannot survive in any except an atmosphere of freedom, we object to a system of universal mass training based on military authority. Because we regard the establishment of a permanent policy of military training on the part of our Government as a reversal to the policies of militarism against which we have labored for these two and half centuries and against which our manhood has suffered and died in two World Wars, we must claim the right to dissent to this proposed policy of our Gov

ernment.

We love our Government and desire to be loyal citizens. We want to bear our share of the burdens of our country, but we cannot follow blindly.

Chairman WOODRUM. Thank you very much, Mr. Bowman.

There is present a gentleman who has said he was just a plain ordinary citizen and did not represent anyone but himself, and that he has come from a distance and would like to be heard. The committee is very glad to hear from that type of citizen, so I would like to hear from Mr. Charles C. Rohrer, a gentleman-farmer from Manchester, Ind.

STATEMENT OF CHARLES C. ROHRER, MANCHESTER, IND.

Mr. ROHRER. I want to thank you, Mr. Woodrum, and I mean that from the bottom of my heart, for allowing a common man like me to appear here. I am just a common farmer; I am not an educated man; I am just one among millions. It is us fellows who do the suffering and dying in the wars, and I think it is fine that you let me come before this honorable committee.

I represent no specific group, but I feel as though I represent millions who are unable to leave their jobs and come here. I thank God that we have such a Government that permits us little fellows to come and be heard, because the Bible says that in a multitude of counsel their is safety.

As a farmer, I hear what my neighbors say about this peacetime conscription, and can state that they are mostly against it, and I think the poll taken by the Town Meeting of the Air proves it, showing some 80 percent from the firesides of America are against it.

We common people do not want our young sons taken from us at the tender years when they need all the guidance we parents can give to keep them in the straight and narrow path. All of us have visions and plans for our sons to go on to higher education and to take over the father's little business or farm. If he is taken from us, we lose control. All parents try to teach their children to have good morals. While the Army has made heroic efforts to close up vice around Army camps, most boys whom I have contacted have privately told me it was still possible to get a girl if one knew the ropes.

I have always told my children to leave off as many vices of life as possible and not form bad habits, as they would only be a load around their necks all their lives.

Boys at this age can stand anything but to be called yellow, and hence when the gang starts smoking, drinking, swearing, and many of the other common vices, they fall in and soon have the same habits. We oldsters know this only too well.

Those of us who embrace Christianity believe all human beings are children of God and it is wrong to take a human life.

Naturally, being educated to kill undoes this teaching.

While wars are inevitable sometimes, I believe they are displeasing to the Lord God of all of us. We have civil laws against the carrying of pistols because sometimes in the heat of passion one uses a pistol to his sorrow. It is necessary to have adequate defense of the country, but I believe as a police force only and surely not to the extent where the tail wags the dog. We have seen these countries that have militarism go down in defeat to the nonmilitary. God still rules the battle.

We little fellows believe that the large steel trusts and munitions makers, and so on, want this bill to pass in order that they may have business, for every year it will mean a complete new outfit for us taxpayers to pay for. This is the same important legislation that has come up for many years, and it will profoundly affect the lives of Americans for generations.

Economically, I do not believe the common people can bear it. It will make peasants out of us. They tell me European peasants are so poor from paying taxes that they have to wear wooden shoes.

As it is, it is difficult for the average American to own an auto, and during the course of a lifetime pay for some little home, or small, and if this terrible load is place on his back, he cannot make ends meet and life even now is one desperate struggle for him to feed his family.

I know some substantial businessmen who are quiting business now because of taxes and red tape, and I know more who would like to quit but cannot do so because of debts.

Instead of peace by force, I suggest we augment peace by cooperation in trade and good will. One does not kill a good commercial friend. Let our foreign policy be that which has been in force with Canada, the Philippines, and China. Let us never exploit anyone. We should place subsidies on all of our exports so that our exporters can trade in foreign markets. We must do this so foreigners can trade with usThis would be an enormous factor for peace and prosperity for America and the world.

Let us liquidate this terrible war debt gradually, taking off GovernLent control as much as possible and show the world what America can do, and I believe we will have peace and prosperity.

I thank you.

Chairman WOODRUM. Thank you very much.

That is a very thoughtful statement.

The committee will recess until 10 o'clock tomorrow morning. (Whereupon, ta 3:20 p. m., the special committee recessed until 10 a. m., Wednesday, June 13, 1945.)

UNIVERSAL MILITARY TRAINING

WEDNESDAY, JUNE 13, 1945

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,

SELECT COMMITTEE ON POSTWAR MILITARY POLICY,

Washington, D. C. The select committee met, pursuant to adjournment, at 10 a. m., in the caucus room, Old House Office Building, Hon. Clifton A. Woodrum (chairman) presiding.

Chairman WOODRUM. The committee will be in order.

The committee will be very glad this morning to hear from Dr. S. V. Sanford, chancelor, University System of Georgia.

Will you come forward and have a seat at the end of the table, sir? Doctor, would you tell us what your university system is, please, so we will know what you represent?

Dr. SANFORD. The university system consists of the 18 institutions of higher learning in the State, and State-supported. They are all under one board, a board of regents, with one executive educational director, and I am the director. The 18 State-supported institutions of higher learning in 1940 had an attendance of about 17,000 students. Chairman WOODRUM. Thank you, sir.

STATEMENT OF DR. S. V. SANFORD, CHANCELOR, UNIVERSITY SYSTEM OF GEORGIA

Dr. SANFORD. Mr. Chairman and members of the Committee on Postwar Military Policy, ladies and gentlemen, I appreciate the invitation extended to me to appear before this distinguished committee and express my views on universal military training. I shall confine my remarks to the time limit assigned me, and for that reason I have committed my statement into writing.

It might not be amiss for some Americans to read and digest some words of warning that Demosthenes gave to the Athenians against Philip of Macedon. It is clearly evident that Philip and Hitler had similar techniques. This is the passage from Demosthenes:

I will first then examine and determine this point-whether it be in our power to deliberate on peace or war. If the country may be at peace, if it depends on us, I affirm that we should maintain peace. But if another, having arms in his hands and a large force around him, lulls you with the name of peace while he carries on the operations of war, what is left but to defend yourselves? You may profess to be at peace, if you like; I quarrel not with that. But if any man supposes this to be a peace which will enable Philip to master all else and attack you last, he is a madman, or he talks of a peace observed toward him by you and not toward you by him. If we really wait until he avows that he is at war with us, we are the simplest of mortals; for he would not declare against Attica and Pieræus, at least if we may judge from his conduct to others.