Mrs. WHITBY. Yes; legislation is necessary. Mr. FISHER. Education, understanding, progress, developed over 200 years. The CHAIRMAN. Now, Mr. Fisher, it took legislation to raise the wages of a great many people who were working for $3 a week to $11, not so long ago, when the wage-hour law was passed. It took legislation to do that. That actually happened. So I think legislation sometimes does help. Do you not think so? Mr. FISHER. I fail to see the analogy. The CHAIRMAN. I mention this because I happen to know a great deal about conditions previous to the time the wage-hour law was enacted. We found that there were people who were paying workers as little as $2 and $3 a week. They paid them $11 a week because they were compelled to do so, and apparently they got along, and their business prospered. Mr. LESINSKI. It did not happen only in the South; it was in New Jersey, Pennsylvania, and everywhere else. The CHAIRMAN. I know of cases in my own State, so I am not accusing the South or any other part of the country. I say it took legislative enactment to really give some people a chance to live. So I think these legislative enactments are useful, and I do believe that years from now we will all find, if we put this law on the statute books, that we are all going to benefit from it-minorities and majorities. Mr. FISHER. I think that some statutes are useful and helpful, and I think that some of them have the opposite effect. The CHAIRMAN. I believe we have different opinions on that subject. Mr. FISHER. In your enthusiasm, you are trying to deal with a big subject that cannot be solved by legislation. You are going in the wrong direction. The CHAIRMAN. There is no simple solution to any problem. Mr. FISHER. You are trying to make it simple, but it just cannot be solved in that way. The CHAIRMAN. No; I do not agree with you there. There is no such thing as a simple solution to any great problem; in fact, to any small problem. But we are going to find a solution, I hope, and I am sure that you hope so too, Mr. Fisher. Mr. FISHER. Well, I hope we will find a solution; in fact, I think we have found the solution already and it should not be interfered with. The CHAIRMAN. If you mean the F. E. P. C., I entirely agree with you. Mr. FISHER. I say we have found it through 200 years of progress in this country; and we did not find it with a Fair Employment Practice Committee. The CHAIRMAN. I think we are finding it since the establishment of F. E. P. C. Thank you very much, Mrs. Whitby. You have really given us a great deal of valuable information. We are grateful to you. The committee will stand adjourned until tomorrow morning at 10 o'clock. (At 12.10 p. m. an adjournment was taken until Wednesday, June 7, 1944, at 10 a. m.) 60811-44-vol. 1- -6 TO PROHIBIT DISCRIMINATION IN EMPLOYMENT WEDNESDAY, JUNE 7, 1944 HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, The committee met at 10 a. m., Hon. Mary T. Norton (chairman) presiding. The CHAIRMAN. The committee will be in order. Our first witness is Dr. Samuel McCrea Cavert, general secretary, Federal Council of the Churches of Christ in America. We shall be glad to hear you at this time, Doctor. STATEMENT OF DR. SAMUEL MCCREA CAVERT, GENERAL SECRETARY, FEDERAL COUNCIL OF THE CHURCHES OF CHRIST IN AMERICA Dr. CAVERT. Madam Chairman, my name is Samuel McCrea Cavert. I am general secretary of the Federal Council of the Churches of Christ in America and appear to express its views, as stated in official action of its executive committee. The Federal Council of the Churches of Christ in America is a federation of 25 national denominations, with a membership in excess of 25,000,000, in 150,000 local congregations in all parts of the Nation. These churches of the federal council have long had a keen interest in the welfare of minority groups in our population and are now deeply concerned over the issue of full justice for them in our economic life. The right of every citizen to work is so fundamental to human welfare and social justice that any discrimination against any worker on account of race, creed, color, or national origin, seems to us a matter of high moral and spiritual significance and a great concern of the churches. That is why I speak in favor of the proposed legislation on this subject, as a representative of the Protestant churches cooperating in the federal council. The Federal Council of Churches has gone on record officially on three different occasions in support of the principle of govenrmental action to remove discrimination in the opportunity for employment. On June 13, 1941, the executive committee of the council defined its position in part in the following words: The executive committee of the Federal Council of the Churches of Christ in America has great concern about the grievous discriminations shown in the exclusion of Negro workers and workers of other minority groups from defense industries, with a few creditable exceptions, and from opportunities and facilities for training for employment in such industries. We consider this question of such paramount importance that we ask for the largest and fullest cooperation on the part of the churches in order that we may prevent a continuance of this injustice against Negroes and other minorities in defense industries and that the relations of these workers and employers may be improved. Again, on September 16, 1943, in a message to the churches of the Nation, the executive committee of the council asserted that— As Christians each of us should give active support to the Fair Employment Practice Committee against discrimination in employment in industry. Finally, at its meeting on March 21, 1944, the executive committee passed the following resolution, definitely urging their Government to establish some permanent procedure for securing fair employment practice and against discrimination, as follows: Discrimination in employment because of race, creed, or national origin is one of the great moral issues before our Nation today. The right of a worker to be employed and paid solely on the basis of this character and ability is so clear, just, and Christian that it should be protected by law. This right should be safeguarded by appropriate legislative and administrative provisions: Be it therefore Resolved, That the Federal Council of Churches urge our Government to establish permanent procedures for securing the objectives which have been sought by the Committee on Fair Employment Practice. A resolution of similar tenor has recently been adopted by the executive committee of the Home Missions Council of North America, as follows: The right and opportunity for any worker to be employed without discrimination on account of race, color, creed, or national origin are so just and so in harmony with Christian ethics that all Christians and church agencies have a deep responsibility to stand for that clear Christian and democratic principle. We believe that government should take such necessary legislative and administrative action as will protect the right to work from any such dsicrimination. The positions thus set forth by action of these two interdenominational bodies, the Federal Council of Churches and the Home Missions Council, have been strongly supported by many of the major denominations meeting individually in their official plenary sessions. As typical of these denominational actions, I wish to put into the record the following resolutions. First, the General Conference of the Methodist Church of Kansas City, Mo., last month, voted as follows: We stand for equal opportunity in employment, upgrading and conditions of work, in exercise of the full rights of citizenship; in access to professional and business careers, in housing, in transportation, and in educational facilities. We endorse the principles underlying the Fair Employment Practice Committee and urge all agencies involved in the administration of the act to improve that administration. The General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church in the United States of America only last week passed the following resolution after full consideration: That the General Assembly commend the essential purpose of the President's Fair Employment Practice Committee as being in keeping with Christian principles, and favor its receiving legislative sanction rather than remaining in its present status as an Executive order. This resolution of the Presbyterian General Assembly is supported by a letter from Dr. Henry Sloane Coffin, the moderator of the Presbyterian General Assembly during the past year, which I should like to read. Dr. GEORGE E. HAYNES, New York, N. Y. JUNE 6, 1944. MY DEAR DR. HAYNES: I greatly regret my inability to appear in person before the Committee on Labor of the House of Representatives on Wednesday to testify in favor of Federal legislation in line with House bill 3986. I believe that the principles of justice that are a part both of our Christian ethic and our democratic way of life make such legislation a moral necessity as an aid in removing the discriminations in industrial employment. Such discriminations should have been outlawed long ago. With all the emphasis I can, I wish to add my voice in urging the Congress to enact such a law and remove the uncertainty that has hung over the very effective work now being done by Executive order under the President's war powers. Yours sincerely, HENRY SLOANE COFFIN. There are several other resolutions along the same general line which I might read, but instead of quoting from them I will simply say for the record that such resolutions have been adopted by the Northern Baptist Convention meeting at Atlantic City last month; by the General Conference of the African Methodist Episcopal Church; by the General Conference of the African Methodist Episcopal Zion Church, and by a considerable number of local councils of churches. and diocesan and other regional bodies in various denominations. Also the Social Action Council of the National Council of the Congregational Churches has specifically endorsed the principles underlying the bill which your committee is now considering. Madam Chairman, in summary, I should like to emphasize the fact that there is an awakening conscience in the churches on the whole question of justice for minority peoples in our national life. When we are asking Negroes and other minorities equally with white to fight and die in defense of democracy on the battlefields of the world, we cannot, in good conscience, be indifferent to any denial of democratic rights in our life at home. And one of the most elementary aspects of interracial justice seems to us to be equal opportunity for all workers to earn their daily bread. That is why there is a widespread support throughout the churches for the objectives sought by the bill which you are now considering. Thank you. The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much, Dr. Cavert. It is very encouraging to this committee to find that the Federal Council of Churches is so deeply interested in this problem. We have also found that all the other churches are interested in the problem; the Catholic Church and the Jewish congregations that we have heard from. In fact, I think everybody who believes in God is interested in this very serious problem and we hope that there will be some way found to bring about greater equity. Certainly we must all admit that every man, regardless of his color or his creed, has the right to find a job. If we do not feel that way, Doctor, it seems to me that this whole war effort would be in vain. We are fighting for democracy-for equal opportunity to work and live-yet here in our own country we have certainly a great deal of discrimination. From all that you have said I gather that you do believe absolutely in equal economic opportunity, for all minority peoples, do you not? Dr. CAVERT. That is the main point which I have been trying to emphasize in the testimony which I have brought here and which has been very effectively expressed, I think, in many actions by different church bodies. The CHAIRMAN. You have done a splendid job. Do you not think, too, that when this war is over, there is going to be a very much greater need of this legislation? |