and underemployment. I happen to have had experience in various countries where many of our colored allies are having preached to them by the Japanese and German radios, that the United States is not sincere when it says that it is fighting a war for the freedom of everybody, because there is discrimination, there is lynching, there is disfranchisement, there are race riots, and all of the other ills which are perpetrated upon people because of race or color. The point that I made is this. If we have a post-war period of racial friction, of riots, growing out of injustices in the matter of jobs, and the like, it will mean simply that while we will have won the war in a purely military sense, we are going to continue to spread suspicion of ourselves as a Nation and virtually have to prepare for another That is what I meant.

war.

Mr. FISHER. You would, then, be opposed to any form of legislation, or any other activity, that might be calculated to promote the very thing you are talking about; would you not?

Mr. WHITE. I would oppose legislation that might be calculated to do what? Mr. FISHER. To promote disunity, and so forth, that you have just been describing.

Mr. WHITE. I think I see the purport of your question, Mr. Fisher. I think we perhaps disagree on what will promote unity and what will promote disunity. Mr. FISHER. Apparently so.

Mr. WHITE. I am quite certain of that. I believe that the Federal Government, taking a stand that the Constitution of the United States means what it says-namely, that all men, irrespective of race, creed, color, or national origin, are entitled to opportunity to work, and to justice under the Constitution and under the laws of our country, will promote unity, rather than disunity, because it will correct basic and long-standing ills.

Mr. FISHER. I do not think you could pick an argument with anyone on the application of the Constitution.

Mr. WHITE. I trust I cannot.

I

The CHAIRMAN. If there are no further questions, thank you, Mr. White. am sorry that we have not had more time to develop your argument, which is an excellent one. You have been most helpful in presenting facts for our record. Mr. WHITE. Thank you, Madam Chairman.

Senator CHAVEZ. We will meet again at 2:30.

(Whereupon, at 12 m., a recess was taken until 2:30 p. m. of the same day.)

AFTERNOON SESSION

(The subcommittee reconvened at 2:35 p. m., pursuant to the recess.)

Senator CHAVEZ. The committee will come to order.

The testimony adduced before the committee up to now has been in reference to the discrimination against the Negro population of the country, and against the Jewish population of the country. It is the purpose of the committee this afternoon to listen to testimony with reference to discriminations against other classes of minorities in the United States.

Before we call the witness that is to appear next, I would like to have the clerk of the committee read into the record a letter received by the chairman of the committee from Alonso S. Perales, of the Committee of One Hundred of San Antonio, Tex. I happen to know the witness personally and I am sure it would be quite a contribution to the information before the committee.

Before reading the letter, I would like to have inserted into the record this statement with reference to Mr. Perales' qualifications. (The statement referred to follows:)

Perales, Alonso S., lawyer, legal adviser to the United States electoral mission in Nicaragua, 1932. Born in Alice, Tex., October 17, 1898. Married. Graduated from public schools of Alice, Tex., and preparatory school, Washington, D. C. Attended School of Arts and Sciences, George Washington University; graduated from the School of Economics and Government, National University,

A. B.; and from National University Law School, LL. B.; admitted to Texas bar, September 1925. Served with the United States Army in Texas during the World War; 21⁄2 years in the Department of Commerce, Washington, D. C. Served in the Diplomatic Service of the United States as assistant to Hon. Sumner Welles; personal representative of the President of the United States in the Dominican Republic, 1922; assistant to the United States delegation, Conference on Central American Affairs, Washington, D. C., 1922-23; assistant to Inter-American High Commission, Washington, D. C., 1923; attorney and interpreter, United States Delegation, Plebiscitary Commission (Gen. John J. Pershing, president), Tacna-Arica arbitration, 1925-26; special assistant to United States delegation to Sixth International Conference of American States, Habana, Cuba, 1928; attorney with agency of the United States, General and Special Claims Commission, United States and Mexico, 1928; attorney, United States electoral mission in Nicaragua, 1928; special assistant to United States delegation to International Conference of American States on Conciliation and Arbitration, Washington, D. C., 1928-29; special legal assistant, Commission of Inquiry and Conciliation, Bolivia and Paraguay, Washington, D. C., 1929; assistant to United States delegation, Congress of Rectors, Deans, and Educators, Habana, Cuba, 1930; legal adviser to the United States electoral mission in Nicaragua in 1930. At present engaged in the private practice of law in San Antonio, Tex. Mr. BADGER (reading):

We are indeed very sorry that because of our inability to secure a plane priority, we shall be deprived of the privilege of testifying before your honorable Committee pursuant to your kind telegraphic invitation. However, we wish to avail ourselves of this opportunity to voice the hope that the President's Committee on Fair Employment Practice may be made permanent by our National Congress at the earliest possible date, in fairness to all the minority groups in the United States, including Latin Americans, and for the good. of our Nation as a whole There is a great deal of discrimination in the economic field in Texas, Arizona, Colorado, and California. There are quite a number of public establishments where persons in Mexican and Hispanic descent generally are not employed, and where they are employed they are not paid the salary or wage that Anglo-Americans receive for the same services. The Committee on Fair Employment Practice has relieved the situation in Government camps and in factories and shops where work is being done for the Federal Government, but in establishments, factories and shops over which said Committee has no jurisdiction, the situation remains the same. Should our National Congress see fit to make the Committee a permanent one, it would serve as a living example to private employers.

We understand Dr. Carlos E. Castaneda will testify before your committee on the 7th instant, and in this connection we wish to state that everything he is going to say to you gentlemen regarding discrimination against Latin Americans is true, and, furthermore, that he enjoys the confidence and respect of the 3,000,000 inhabitants of Mexican descent in the United States.

Referring to the social phase of discrimination in Texas, we are prepared to prove that discrimination exists against persons of Mexican and Hispanic descent, including members of the armed forces of our Nation, in 249 out of the 254 counties in the State, and that said discrimination consists not only of slights and humiliations in restaurants, theaters, barber shops, and other public places of business but also segregation in public schools and residential districts. Not only persons of Mexican lineage are victims of such discrimination. Venezuelans, Hondurans, and Argentinians, some of them members of the Armies of said countries, have also been discriminated against.

For the past 4 years we have been asking the Texas Legislature to pass a law forbidding the humiliation of Mexicans and Hispanic peoples generally in this State, but it has absolutely refused to do so. Among the legislators who have actively opposed the enactment of such a law are Senator R. A. Weinert, of Seguin, and

Representative Frank B. Voight, of New Braunfels. Seguin and New Braunfels are two German-American communities of Texas that have always distinguished themselves for their anti-Mexicanism.

There are some people who opine that the solution of this problem rests in waging an educational campaign among the Anglo-American element designed to show them the merits and qualities of the Mexicans and of the Hispanic race generally, but the overwhelming majority of us contend that in addition to such an educational program there is need for a Federal law prohibiting the humiliation of Mexicans and persons of Hispanic descent generally in any part of our country. A Federal law is necessary in order to put an end to this painful situation immediately. The educational program is useful, but it is very slow, and we have no time to lose. We are at war and in order to win it we need unity among the peoples of the Americas. The best way to show all the inhabitants of Hispanic America that they are respected in our country is to pass a Federal law making it unlawful for anyone to humilate them here. The citizens of Venezuela, Honduras, Argentina and the other Hispanic American Republics feel just as deeply hurt as the citizens of Mexico when they learn that there are places in the United States where members of their race, and above all their fellow-citizens, are humiliated; more so at this moment when more than a quarter of a million soldiers of Mexican descent are giving their blood for democracy. The resentment of these sister Republics of ours has reached the point where Mexico, for example, has become quite firm in her resolve not to send more workers to Texas until an end is put to these humiliations.

The writer has just returned from the Congress of the Inter-American Bar Association held in Mexico City from July 31 to August 8, at which the matter of racial discrimination, in all its phases, was thoroughly gone into, and you should have seen the attitude of the Hispanic-American delegates upon the subject. All of the Latin-American Republics, except three, were represented, and 47 bar associations from the United States were likewise represented. There were 450 delegates from the Western Hemisphere. The Congress went on record, unanimously, as condemning said discrimination, and they passed a resolution recommending to the Governments of the American Republics that a treaty be entered into by them to the effect that no country will permit the citizens of the other American states residing within its territory to be humiliated by any corporation, institution, society, organization, or person because of race, creed, color, or national origin, and, further, that the states of the Americas establish adequate penalties, through Federal legislation, for all cases in which the provisions of said treaty may be violated. It is thus seen, Senator Chavez, that the problem has become an international problem insofar as the Western Hemisphere is concerned, and one that should be settled by the Federal Governments; and the sooner our Government takes the necessary steps to end the shameful situation existing in our country the better it will be for our Nation. We need the cooperation and good will of all the Hispanic American peoples not only now that we are at war but in the days of peace that are to follow. However, we shall never have their good will and cooperation until we learn to treat them and respect them as our equals. At present our governments are united, but the peoples of the Americas are not, precisely for that reason.

As regards the thousands of American citizens of Mexican decent who are fighting in the battle fronts, the best way to encourage them to continue fighting with enthusiasm is to pass a Federal law that will assure to them that our Federal Government does not intend to permit anyone to humiliate them or any member of their families, either in Texas or in any other State of the Union, merely because they are Mexicans by blood. Incidentally, it might be said in passing that the casualty lists published in the local newspapers show that from 50 to 75 percent of those from south Texas who are falling, either dead or wounded, are soldiers of Mexican descent. Our Federal Government owes it to these boys to make sure that when they return to the United States they will find the kind of democracy that they have been given to understand they are fighting for. It would be a great disappointment to them, to say the least, to find upon their return that they could not secure employment or that if they found it they could not receive equal wages for equal work merely because of their racial origin, or that the owner of any restaurant, barber shop, or theater could continue to humiliate them as he saw fit just because they were of Mexican descent. In this connection, permit us to cite a paragraph from a letter which we received recently from a young United States Army officer of Mexican descent who took part in the invasion of Normandy:

"The assault boat I was leading was sunk several hundred yards from the beach, but all of my men managed to swim safely ashore. It was a veritable hell. Sniper bullets, machine-gun fire, mortar and artillery shells, and personnel mines took their toll of victims. I saw many of my close friends-officers and men-get shot right through the head by deadly sniper fire.

"When I think of the men left dead on the beaches, I wonder if the people at home understand this tremendous sacrifice. I wonder particularly if those who are charged with the responsibility of framing the peace to come fully realize the cost of victory. I pray that when the fighting is all done, our boys can go back with the utmost assurance that they can live and work in peace and that America still remains the symbol of liberty, justice, and freedom. I have sworn that if ever the combatants of this war are cheated of the things they risked their lives for and for which thousands of their comrades gave their lives, I shall take the stump loud and strong and shall not cease in my condemnation of such fraud.' In conclusion, allow us to emphasize, Senator Chavez, that it is most urgent that our Government make the Committee on Fair Employment Practice a permanent organization and to enact federal legislation at once forbidding all phases of discrimination on account of race, color, creed, national origin or ancestry. This, in fairness to all the minority groups in our country, and as a token of friendship and respect for the peoples of the Hispanic-American Republics.

You may read this letter to the other members of your committee and you may incorporate same in the record of your hearings, if you wish.

Again thanking you for the invitation extended us, and regretting our inability to be present for the reason already stated, we remain

Sincerely yours,

ALONSO S. PERALES, Chairman.

Senator CHAVEZ. I might state that Alonso S. Perales is an American of Mexican extraction residing in the city of San Antonio, Tex. He has a beautiful record of service to his country, not only on the field of battle during the last war, but also in civil work.

I will now call on Dr. Carlos E. Castaneda.

STATEMENT OF DR. CARLOS E. CASTANEDA, SPECIAL ASSISTANT ON LATIN-AMERICAN PROBLEMS TO THE CHAIRMAN OF THE PRESIDENT'S COMMITTEE ON FAIR EMPLOYMENT PRACTICE Senator CHAVEZ. Does your statement contain some information with reference to your background in the matter of education?

Dr. CASTANEDA. Yes, Senator; a brief sketch of my interest in this problem of discrimination.

Senator CHAVEZ. Does it contain any reference whatsoever to your own personal background?

Dr. CASTANEDA. No, Senator.

Senator CHAVEZ. I wish you would state to the committee, make a brief statement, with reference to your background.

Dr. CASTANEDA. I have been professor of history at the University of Texas since-

Senator CHAVEZ (interposing). That is rather far advanced. Where were you born?

Dr. CASTANEDA. I was born in Mexico. I am a naturalized citizen of the United States at the present time. I served as a volunteer in the other World War. I received my academic degrees from the University of Texas. I have a B. A., M. A., and Ph. D. I have an honorary degree in law from the University of St. Edwards.

Senator CHAVEZ. Let's get this straight now so we might understand. You were born in Mexico?

Dr. CASTANEDA. That is right.

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Senator CHAVEZ. You came to the United States?

Dr. CASTANEDA. That is right.

Senator CHAVEZ. You became a naturalized citizen?

Dr. CASTANEDA. Yes, sir.

Senator CHAVEZ. Your training and education was received in the United States?

Dr. CASTANEDA. Yes, sir.

Senator CHAVEZ. You now have an M. A. degree from the University of Texas?

Dr. CASTANEDA. Yes, sir.

Senator CHAVEZ. Where did you get your doctor's degree?

Dr. CASTANEDA. University of Texas in 1932.

Senator CHAVEZ. You have a degree from St. Edwards? Where is St. Edwards located?

Dr. CASTANEDA. In Austin.

Senator CHAVEZ. And you were a soldier in the last war?

Dr. CASTANEDA. Yes; I served as a volunteer in the United States Army.

May I proceed?

Senator CHAVEZ. You may proceed.

Dr. CASTANEDA. For more than 20 years I have been interested in the problems arising from the various forms of discrimination against the Spanish-speaking people of the Southwest. I have been an active member of the League of United Latin American Citizens, Loyal Latin American Citizens, the Catholic Association for International Peace on its Committee on Inter-American Relations, the Southwestern Committee on Latin-American Culture, the InterAmerican Bibliographical and Library Association, and other national and international associations interested in the promotion of better relations and understanding between Anglos and Latin-Americans. I was appointed senior fair practice examiner in region X, comprising the States of Texas, New Mexico, and Louisiana, on August 23, 1943, and was made acting regional director in charge of the Dallas office until December 17, 1943, when I was made special assistant to the chairman on Latin-American problems, in which capacity I have served the committee since that time.

Our Spanish-speaking population in the Southwest, made up almost entirely of American citizens of Mexican extraction and Mexican nationals are ill-dressed, ill-fed, ill-cared for medically, and ill-educated, all because of the low economic standard to which they have been relegated as the result of the general policy of restricting their employment and utilization to the lowest paid, least desirable, and most exacting jobs from the physical standpoint. Not only have they been restricted to the lowest bracket jobs, but even in these jobs they have been paid wages below the minimum of sound and tested going rates in all the various industries in which they have been employed.

In the investigation of complaints filed with the President's Committee on Fair Employment Practice involving discrimination against Spanish-speaking Latin-American citizens of Mexican extraction and Mexican nationals, I have visited the States of Arizona, California, Colorado, New Mexico, and Texas and I have had an opportunity to study conditions at first hand. I have gathered statistics that reveal the magnitude of the problem insofar as it affects what is the largest underprivileged minority group in the Southwest.